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Jahia versus Magnolia (and Hippo)?

by  ashleyaitken »  2012/04/16 06:39

Hi,

Can someone please help with advantages (and any disadvantages) Jahia has when compared to Magnolia (and if possible Hipp)?

I would like to know general reasons why one would choose Jahia over Magnolia (and vice-versa).

I will start with one I believe to be true: Jahia allows use of CE for production whereas Magnolia does not?

Also similar for Hippo CMS if that is possible.

I will start with one I believe to be true: Hippo uses Apache license whereas Jahia and Magnolia use GPL.

I know, of course, the most appropriate CMS will depend on what one is trying to use it for, but here I am looking for a general comparison.

Thanks in advance for any assistance.

Cheers,
Ashley.

PS I know lines of code is not a measure of features or quality but Ohloh seems to suggest Jahia has about 600K lines of code, whereas Magnolia has 20 millon and Hippo 440K.

 

  (ashleyaitken)

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Re : Jahia versus Magnolia (and Hippo)?

by  theklem »  2012/04/18 13:39

Hi Ashley,

I'll try to do a longer post asap to go deeper into the differences / advantages of Jahia versus Hippo or Magnolia

First of all, let me answer to your basic questions : yes, you can use CE in production but you won't have support from he Jahia company in case of bugs and you won't benefit from some adavanced features or management capabilities and UIs that simplifies a lot the platform management. You can find easily the differences between all versions on the website.

You're right the Jahia Community Edition is GPL.

Finally, the 20 millions lines of code you've found for Magnolia represent certainly the totality of their code repository (all versions, all branches), while the 600.000 lines for Jahia represent only the trunk (1 version, no branches), which is much more accurate. In fact I think that Magnolia for it's product is certainly in the same range as Jahia and Hippo are :  between 500K and 1 million lines of code. The feature set (and underlaying frameworks) are very close in both products - it's the magic touch on top that changes everything ;-) - so you should be very worry if Magnolia really had 20M loc while Jahia would be able to do mor with 600K.

  • Re : Jahia versus Magnolia (and Hippo)?
    2012/04/18 13:40

    theklem <p> Hi Ashley,</p> <p> I&#39;ll try to do a longer post asap to go deeper into the differences / advantages of Jahia versus Hippo or Magnolia</p> <p> First of all, let me answer to your basic questions : yes, you can use CE in production but you won&#39;t have support from he Jahia company in case of bugs and you won&#39;t benefit from some adavanced features or management capabilities and UIs that simplifies a lot the platform management. You can find easily the differences between all versions on the website.</p> <p> You&#39;re right the Jahia Community Edition is GPL.</p> <p> Finally, the 20 millions lines of code you&#39;ve found for Magnolia represent certainly the totality of their code repository (all versions, all branches), while the 600.000 lines for Jahia represent only the trunk (1 version, no branches), which is much more accurate. In fact I think that Magnolia for it&#39;s product is certainly in the same range as Jahia and Hippo are : &nbsp;between 500K and 1 million lines of code. The feature set (and underlaying frameworks) are very close in both products - it&#39;s the magic touch on top that changes everything ;-) - so you should be very worry if Magnolia really had 20M loc while Jahia would be able to do mor with 600K.</p>

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    Re: Re : Jahia versus Magnolia (and Hippo)?

    by  ashleyaitken »  2012/04/19 06:10

     

    Hi theklem,

    Thanks for your post and confirming/explaining the differences I noted.

    I hope you can post about the differences / advantages / disadvantages of Jahia versus Magnolia (and Hippo), that would be really helpful for us (and I assume others)

    I understand the benefits of the Enterprise edition and would like to use that as soon as possible, but we are a very early stage startup and have not yet received funding.

    Cheers,
    Ashley.

     

      (ashleyaitken)

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    Re : Jahia versus Magnolia (and Hippo)?

    by  theklem »  2012/04/23 14:34

     

    Hi Ashley, sorry for the delay
    today, comparing software on a market such as ours is a difficult task (and being passionate about our Jahia software is part of the problem ;) particularly because previous segmentation of the market (the classic wcm / dm / portal etc. separation) is obsolete. Convergence of requirements completely disrupted previous established order. Each product come from a market / technology niche with great innovation and other great specific features also developed by passionate people and open source lovers.

    You can increase your global understanding by reading some articles about each product and neutral comparison like:
    http://www.arslogica.com/compass_guide_reports/
    http://www.smile.fr/Livres-blancs/English-white-papers

    Real Story Group (you may request a free evaluation on the page):
    http://www.realstorygroup.com/Reports/CMS/
    “We'll email you excerpts from one of our CMS vendor evaluations.”

    We’ve believed in convergence (between web, document, portal, collaboration and social related content) since our inception. Our vision was to deliver the best platform to  support this convergence through one unified user interface and, coming with 6.5, a unique VISUAL user experience builder, the Jahia Studio. We’ve also aimed at lowering the development entry barrier with an extension mechanism (modules), similar to what php developers have known for years, but relying on a rock solid java platform embedding the most mature open source project and frameworks.

    That being said, here are some highlights about Jahia’s distinctive features, helping you better understand our positioning:
    - Jahia is content centric: depending on the type of project you envision, this is a major difference. The granularity of Jahia's content model offers a deeper control on each content item: this provides greater benefit when it comes to repurposing, reusing content or controlling precisely how your content should behave (roles, workflow, layout, display options, etc.). Of course, these advantages needs to be balanced with the specific objectives or your project. For a basic website scenario, this granularity is perhaps not necessary and Magnolia may be an easier choice. For intranet or portal scenarios, complex websites or content based applications, the Jahia model and its widely recognized flexibility may be more appropriate.
    - Jahia works great with structured content. For instance, Jahia offer options beyond the unique paragraph concept - more suited to create unstructured objects that must be displayed in a page (basically a paragraph = a bigtext field with a WYSIWYG editor in the Edit UI) - Jahia offers a variety of additional objects with multiple properties you can manipulate at will, sort, validate; repurpose, etc. You can obviously decide to only use a simple, unstructured approach in Jahia (the unique paragraph concept, with mainly bigtext fields, is useful especially if you don't need more complex objects) but the ability to really declare, control and manipulate a wide range of additional object types is very powerful in more complex scenarios (such as MultiChannel, portals, large interactive and social site etc...). Also important: all Jahia editing UIs are auto-generated based on simple content definitions: not having to create your own input masks is a huge time saver and cuts development time.

    - Jahia embeds several frameworks that are very important if you plan to manipulate your content through API and code, and if you want your Jahia instance to interact with other apps / systems, the most important ones are (this isn’t an exhaustive list) :

    • Jboss Drools (having a rules engine in the CMS is really great, it allows faster development, easy implementation of events based features. One of our system integrator partner (French) described this as a genius idea: http://blog.smile.fr/Retour-sur-la-nouvelle-version-de-Jahia-la-6.5-xCM
    • Apache Camel (great for routing content between systems, define in and out points, etc...)
    • jBPM (a lightweight, extensible workflow engine) is a standard supported by a wide range of third party systems.
    • Jahia supports multiple scripting languages (groovy, velocity, freemarker.. even PHP with the Caucho Resin framework), which makes our platform more accessible to developer not fluent with Java
    • Caching mechanisms in Jahia is based on our long experience fine tuning performance for large and high traffic websites: we deliver a sophisticated and efficient caching solution that deals with both automatic invalidation and expiration. This allows to avoid dependencies and flush management problems, which is key to complex, large and/or interactive sites scenarios.


    There are certainly many additional differentiators between Jahia and other systems, but the ones I’ve listed should be useful to you -considering your questions. My advice will be to test each solution you consider (or request a demo) to validate the ergonomics as well. As a matter of facts, the best architecture is nothing if 1/ your users cannot benefit from it and 2/ the strengths of the selected CMS isn’t in line with your project objectives.

  • Re : Jahia versus Magnolia (and Hippo)?
    2012/04/23 14:34

    theklem <p> &nbsp;</p> <p> Hi Ashley, sorry for the delay<br /> today, comparing software on a market such as ours is a difficult task (and being passionate about our Jahia software is part of the problem ;) particularly because previous segmentation of the market (the classic wcm / dm / portal etc. separation) is obsolete. Convergence of requirements completely disrupted previous established order. Each product come from a market / technology niche with great innovation and other great specific features also developed by passionate people and open source lovers.<br /> <br /> You can increase your global understanding by reading some articles about each product and neutral comparison like:<br /> http://www.arslogica.com/compass_guide_reports/<br /> <a href="http://www.smile.fr/Livres-blancs/English-white-papers">http://www.smile.fr/Livres-blancs/English-white-papers</a><br /> <br /> Real Story Group (you may request a free evaluation on the page):<br /> <a href="http://www.realstorygroup.com/Reports/CMS/">http://www.realstorygroup.com/Reports/CMS/</a><br /> &ldquo;We&#39;ll email you excerpts from one of our CMS vendor evaluations.&rdquo;<br /> <br /> We&rsquo;ve believed in convergence (between web, document, portal, collaboration and social related content) since our inception. Our vision was to deliver the best platform to &nbsp;support this convergence through one unified user interface and, coming with 6.5, a unique VISUAL user experience builder, the Jahia Studio. We&rsquo;ve also aimed at lowering the development entry barrier with an extension mechanism (modules), similar to what php developers have known for years, but relying on a rock solid java platform embedding the most mature open source project and frameworks.<br /> <br /> That being said, here are some highlights about Jahia&rsquo;s distinctive features, helping you better understand our positioning:<br /> - Jahia is content centric: depending on the type of project you envision, this is a major difference. The granularity of Jahia&#39;s content model offers a deeper control on each content item: this provides greater benefit when it comes to repurposing, reusing content or controlling precisely how your content should behave (roles, workflow, layout, display options, etc.). Of course, these advantages needs to be balanced with the specific objectives or your project. For a basic website scenario, this granularity is perhaps not necessary and Magnolia may be an easier choice. For intranet or portal scenarios, complex websites or content based applications, the Jahia model and its widely recognized flexibility may be more appropriate.<br /> - Jahia works great with structured content. For instance, Jahia offer options beyond the unique paragraph concept - more suited to create unstructured objects that must be displayed in a page (basically a paragraph = a bigtext field with a WYSIWYG editor in the Edit UI) - Jahia offers a variety of additional objects with multiple properties you can manipulate at will, sort, validate; repurpose, etc. You can obviously decide to only use a simple, unstructured approach in Jahia (the unique paragraph concept, with mainly bigtext fields, is useful especially if you don&#39;t need more complex objects) but the ability to really declare, control and manipulate a wide range of additional object types is very powerful in more complex scenarios (such as MultiChannel, portals, large interactive and social site etc...). Also important: all Jahia editing UIs are auto-generated based on simple content definitions: not having to create your own input masks is a huge time saver and cuts development time.<br /> <br /> - Jahia embeds several frameworks that are very important if you plan to manipulate your content through API and code, and if you want your Jahia instance to interact with other apps / systems, the most important ones are (this isn&rsquo;t an exhaustive list) :</p> <ul> <li> Jboss Drools (having a rules engine in the CMS is really great, it allows faster development, easy implementation of events based features. One of our system integrator partner (French) described this as a genius idea: <a href="http://blog.smile.fr/Retour-sur-la-nouvelle-version-de-Jahia-la-6.5-xCM">http://blog.smile.fr/Retour-sur-la-nouvelle-version-de-Jahia-la-6.5-xCM</a></li> <li> Apache Camel (great for routing content between systems, define in and out points, etc...)</li> <li> jBPM (a lightweight, extensible workflow engine) is a standard supported by a wide range of third party systems.</li> <li> Jahia supports multiple scripting languages (groovy, velocity, freemarker.. even PHP with the Caucho Resin framework), which makes our platform more accessible to developer not fluent with Java</li> <li> Caching mechanisms in Jahia is based on our long experience fine tuning performance for large and high traffic websites: we deliver a sophisticated and efficient caching solution that deals with both automatic invalidation and expiration. This allows to avoid dependencies and flush management problems, which is key to complex, large and/or interactive sites scenarios.</li> </ul> <p> <br /> There are certainly many additional differentiators between Jahia and other systems, but the ones I&rsquo;ve listed should be useful to you -considering your questions. My advice will be to test each solution you consider (or request a demo) to validate the ergonomics as well. As a matter of facts, the best architecture is nothing if 1/ your users cannot benefit from it and 2/ the strengths of the selected CMS isn&rsquo;t in line with your project objectives.</p>

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    Registration date Apr 23, 2012
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